Shooting Remington's New R51 9x19mm Plus P Semi-Automatic Pistol - Gunblast.com




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Gunblastdotcom: Look for a full review on the new Remington R51 later, after I can get one in here to Gunblast.com World Headquarters for a few days. Shooting several of these at Gunsite was a lot of fun, but there was no means to do any meaningful accuracy testing while i was there. Jeff

Rick Wiggins: Jeff. You're an honest man. Could you recommend this pistol to a friend now, knowing what you do about it?

Calvin Ledford: This is ridiculous! The September issue of Guns has a cover story on the R51! The guns seem to have quietly been pulled from the market (try to find one on gun broker), it has been more than 100 days since the first guns started going back and no fix or even update from Remington. At this point the issues with the R51 are well known. I find it completely irresponsible for gun mags to continue to provide positive reviews based on "eval guns" when the production version has so many issues. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/05/foghorn/shooting-illustrated-remingtons-r51-erosion-journalistic-integrity/ 

Calvin Ledford: A comment posted yesterday (6/19/2014) on the Remington Owners R51 forum by user "maccountrypilot" "I sent my R51 back 3 months ago and still nothing. I managed to talk to the Senior V.P and General Manager of Remington handguns. Based on that conversation I have asked for a refund. It is my opinion that Remington is no where close to fixing the issues with this pistol. It is time for me to cut my losses and move on. I wish the best of luck to the rest of you ... but as for me I am totally done with Remington."

IamBaal: I need your help and anybody can please answer my question. There is a new pistol that is supposedly coming out and I seen the video on YT I just do not remember the name. It is coming out in 9mm and the show comparisons between their pistol and other pistols showing the muzzle rise after shooting. It is coming out in polymer and steel this year I believe? It is supposed to be better than Glock specifically and I wanted to buy it.

Sam Man: I hate to be the oddball but man do I think that gun is ugly. Looks like it shoots well, but ugly.

Scott Smith: That was almost a complete lie from the remington guy, these are terrible to shoot, hard on the web of your hand, and are fairly unreliable. Add to that they are stupid difficult to re-assemble properly, and you have a very expensive mistake. And yes, I have shot them, no I don't hate remington, but this gun is pretty bad. There are things they could do to fix it, but if they didn't during testing I doubt they would now with it being so new.

TheCircleMRanch: Why buy a gun that has so many problems. If you want a good weapon of this general design by a PPK. Good Luck, Be Safe

rcbif101: Does the slide ride on aluminum or steel rails?

Calvin Ledford: Hard to believe another week has come and gone and still nothing from Remington - a fix or even an update. Rumor had it that there would be resolution sometime in June. Being that it is already the 19th, if they announced something today, I think it would be a stretch to think that all people with RMA guns would for certain have theirs back by the end of the month when considering business days, shipping time etc. Given other rumors as to plants being closed and manufacturing relocated to AL, I can see this stretching out even longer. More concerning, I have extremely low confidence that when considering a large scale manufacturing move, new equipment, new staff, new plant etc. that this is even truly going even going to get resolved this go around. Further, most of the rumors about fixes seem to have related to replacing slides, redesigned breach blocks and internal tweaks, I have yet to hear about barrels being replaced to address chamber issues.

kenneth NELSON: I'm thinking this might be a perfect gun for the wife. 

Calvin Ledford: Update - Remington released an update (7/25) that they are "replacing" all R51s. Production of the new guns is "expected" to start sometime in October. Note, this DOES NOT mean anyone will be getting their gun replaced in October (which will already be over 7 months from when Remington started getting the malfunctioning guns back on RMA) - rather it means that they might be started producing the parts required for the production of the new guns on or by 10/31. There is NO ETA on when owners might actually get a replace gun back. Oh, and I should mention that the "new" R51s will be produced in a brand new plant, in a different state, presumably staffed with brand new employees who've not even worked in the firearms industry. Here is my take on the "update"... First and foremost, let me speak to Remington’s claim “we determined the pistols were safe. . .” – I find this statement to be an utter falsehood. The R51 was and has only been marketed as a self-defense oriented, designed for concealed carry, combat handgun. Any firearm intended for this role, which is anything less than scrupulously reliable, is for certain *dangerous* in that it cannot be trusted to function if absolutely required to do so in a life or death situation. The R51 has shown a grievous LACK of reliability related to not one, not two, but SEVERAL well documented issues. These issues include (but are not limited to): an almost ubiquitous trait of not going fully into battery when being loaded, a propensity for repetitively exhibiting failures to function (mainly related to failure to extract), magazines that regularly fall out of the gun while shooting, and (most seriously) a documented (in multiple guns) ability to fire out of battery (a dangerous condition taken alone) which leads to the massively deformed case locking up the gun. The bracketed inserts below are my comments and opinion. “Earlier this year, we launched the innovative R51 subcompact pistol to critical acclaim. [But that acclaim was NOT based on a functional review of the gun- which was conspicuously NOT present at the 2014 Shot Show Range Day] [Oh, and "sub-compact" is a reeeaaal stretch...] During testing, numerous experts found the pistol to function flawlessly. [So called “experts” who by in large shot the guns at Remington paid for corporate junkets where said “experts” were wined and dined, and treated to days of free shooting by Remington? Experts who later reported that the guns HAD malfunctioned at the Gunsite launch – but attempted to explain away the malfunctions as caused by wind and dust at the range?] In fact, they found it to have lower felt recoil, lower muzzle rise and better accuracy and concealability than other products in its class. [What obnoxious marketing crap given that they have had some people guns back on RMA for over 120 days now and nothing of any significance to these individuals has been stated at this point in the so called “update”!] However, after initial commercial sales, our loyal customers notified us that some R51 pistols had performance issues. [“Some R51 pistols?! SOME? Really?!! They are going to use “news speak” to paint an image that only “some” guns had issues?] We immediately ceased production to re-test the product. While we determined the pistols were safe [As an owner of 2 of these guns I whole hearted disagree that these guns are “safe” at all], certain units did not meet Remington’s performance criteria. [And how, pray tell, did these “some” guns make it out the door? And given that they did, we're now just supposed to believe that future guns will be solid? Seriously?] The performance problems resulted from complications during our transition from prototype to mass production. These problems have been identified and solutions are being implemented, with an expected production restart in October. [With an “expected” restart of production? Does anyone really believe this? What exactly does “expected restart of production” mean anyhow? That on October 31st they might start making the parts again that ultimately are required to be assembled into functional pistols to return to owners? How long does it take from the “expected restart” to when fully functional guns are shipping to owners? Does anyone seriously think that they will be getting their gun back before mid-December at best?] Anyone who purchased an R51 may return it and receive a new R51 pistol, along with two additional magazines and a custom Pelican case, by calling Remington at (800) 243-9700. [My opinion on what this means – “we’re recalling this turd, but don’t want to call it that – so instead we’re “replacing” any R51s that have already been purchased.”] The new R51 will be of the same exceptional quality as our test pistols, which performed flawlessly. [We’re supposed to take this company’s word that they ever produced a quality product in the first place? Why, because the “experts” they are so cozy with reported only SOME issues with “pre-production guns?” Because of the “critical acclaim” that was based on NOT shooting the R51? What about durability by the way? Anyone going to mention the fact that the current guns have been showing a propensity to shred themselves severely in fewer than 100 rounds? That upon cleaning your gun after burning a box of ammo at the range, metal chips fall out of it?] We appreciate your patience and support.” [Patience? I purchased 2 R51s in mid-March - by the time I expect I will actually receive replacements in mid-December *9 MONTHS WITHOUT A FUNCTIONING GUN WILL HAVE PASSED.* And my compensation is to be a plastic case in lieu of the cardboard box originally provided with the gun?] I’ve learned to be very careful about saying “never” about anything in life. However, I will NEVER be purchasing another Remington product again. I don’t care if they truly do get the bugs worked out of the R51. [Something I seriously doubt] I also want to get his on record now. In the end, even if these guns can be debugged enough to function on some level that could reasonably be called "reliable" I believe the guns will STILL face a durability issue that will ultimately destroy them the longer they are shot. My honest belief (based on my guns and the wear they show from just a few hundred shots) is that these guns will have a service life of 1500 hundred rounds. Read more: http://www.gunsandammo.com/2014/07/25/r ... z38m5XFBcJ 

Fireguzzi Forge: Cant wait for the full review. I am really interested in this gun.

PurityofEssence: That guy on the left looks like Michael Ian Black.

sTEVAL570: I purchased one brand new, had it for two weeks. Got rid of it. I should have lit my money on fire, probably would have been more entertaining. 

NewJerseyMilitia: Is it accurate and up to what distance?

E.W.E. Hughes Jr: I like it. Remington seems to be differentiating themselves from some of the other firearms manufacturers with this pistol. I like the full-length grip and the size. We have plenty of micro-9mm pistols on the market; it's nice that single-stack 9mm for those that may want to take a path less traveled. 

Ken Rhodes: Where is it made?

oneeyedpatriot: That is a fine looking gun! Thanks for yet another fine review!

SGT SAM: Way cool gun. Great look! 

WaltD1911: Looks like a cool gun Jeff and I'll wait for your review. Great channel and enjoy your vids! Happy New Year to all!

Ryan Peck: No price set yet?

jlen82: Jeff size wise is this Similar to an LC9? 

Dave Marotto: It's just my opinion. Calm down.

They Live you Sleep: friend has one.. POS who was smoking crack when making this one

Parker chief: JUNK

lsw w: What are the overall dimensions and weight?

Derrick Lepin: I hope someone (Remington? 3rd party?) makes new grip panels with increased palm swell, akin to a Walther PPK/S. Then I could see me moving the the R-51.

Calvin Ledford: Hey Jeff, How about bringing some of your influence in bear on this issue? Given that YOUR reviews were trusted by many a duped R51 owner who purchased this albatross? These guns are systemically (across a whole spectrum of serial numbers) showing very serious (and very common, very consistent, very well publicized) safety, reliability, and manufacturing issues (including non-SAAMI spec chambers) that cannot be ignored and are certainly inexcusable under any circumstance. There are numerous reports of owners who literally only had possession of their guns for days and since the guns have been back at Remington for greater than 9 weeks now - yet Remington will provide NO update to these owners as to when, or even if, they will ever even see their guns again. I (along with many others) used to place trust in you, especially as the main stream gun media sold out their credibility years ago. I don't expect them to do the right thing here, but as a member of the alterative media, I expect you to do so. You've put yourself out as someone who speaks the truth and isn't bought and paid for by the industry, so why not step up and weigh in on what (given the stature of Remington and all of the press after the shot show) is probably the biggest gun launch failure ever? The fact that Remington provided your vacation out to Gunsite clearly puts your credibility into question on this firearm. I'd think you'd want to do whatever you could to put this situation right, while distancing yourself from Remington for their putting you is such a compromised position. So are you going to step up on behalf of ALL of the people who've been taken for a ride by Big Green and the MSM gun industry press, or were you actually part of the whole sordid affaire after all, despite your prostrations to the contrary? There's an old Ben Franklin saying that you seem to be of the sort to appreciate - "Believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see." I now believe none of what you say and am waiting to see what you do to determine if it might ever be possible to trust you again. There are others who feel the same way. Either Remington put you a really bad spot and has sullied your good name through making you an unwitting accomplice to this debacle, or you were knowledgeable party to this whole mess. Actions speak louder than words, so why not tell us which it really was?

Ken ibn Anak: Hmm, how is the size of it compared to the original 380 variant? Will a holster for the new one fit the older ones? Is there any parts interchangeability?

shadowalker1776: Looking forward to picking one of these up for myself.

Kevin Springer: Ugly

loytaylor75: i just watched a 3min 50sec add for remington!

TrinityGadgetry: I didn't see an R51 being shot. And why is Gunsites' trademark a Reichsadler?

Dee Piper: I like it! 

Towald Graves: Nice.....

higuything21: Johny Knoxville?

surf@work: you weren't bullcrapting, that muzzle flip looks nice.. 

Aglassdarkly116: I've been noticing the screws on the grip, been wondering if the grips are able to be swapped out with some g10 or hogues to personalize it. Haven't seen anything else on that. Seems crimson trace is doing a laser guard for it rather than grips, but I prefer that system on a small carry gun anyway. Excellent accompaniment on the video. Can't help but think of "little mountain church house."

Christopher Meyerhofer: You said to go to www.crimsontrace.com to find the laser grips. I couldn't find it. They don't have it under their "New to 2014" section.

travis bickle: I like the concept , but I really wish it were DA/SA with an exposed hammer- for the price they are going for now (far north of the 389$ retail) I can't justify not buying a glock or beretta or? instead of this- I've heard from a few reviewers that I trust that the grip safety is pretty stiff too- kinda a disappointment

Charles Messer: I like it, I would love it without the grip safety

J Scott: I am quite sure if it feels as good as it looks and lives up the hype on its perceived dependability, I will be buying one also. Thank you for the video, it was easy on the eyes (even with you in it) and ears. 

CC D: Is the r51 a single action with only a grip safety? If it's reliable, I want one. Please let us know about the safety features. I'm a little concerned about a roostered single action pistol in a soft sided IWB holster. Thanks!

Alan Taylor: I appreciate all the close-ups at the end. Going to take a look at this.

Roy Diedesch: Did you look at the breach action on this? "Hesitation Locked" - "When the cartridge is fired, the bolt and slide move together a short distance rearward powered by the energy of the cartridge as in a standard blowback system. When the breech block contacts the locking shoulder, it stops, locking the breech in place. The slide continues rearward with the momentum it acquired in the initial phase. This allows chamber pressure to drop to safe levels while the breech is locked and the cartridge slightly extracted. Once the bullet leaves the barrel and pressure drops, the continuing motion of the slide lifts the breech block from its locking recess through a cam arrangement, continuing the firing cycle." If you look at the pictures, they have a 3-4mm spacer that catches on the returning barrel assembly so the safety of your face relies on a miniscule metal tab. Sounds like an explosion waiting to happen. Nice try though, Remington.

Robert Cave: Additional calibers to follow? I hope they make a R53 based on the Model 53. But WW I ended and so did the chance of Remington getting a contract to produce the Model 53.

Larry Ransom: Who is performing the background music (Battle Cry of Freedom). I sure hopes it's the Southern Version of that song!

j;alksdjf;asf: WOW, BILL HADER REVIEWS GUNS?

Kyle TheGunNut: Good looking gun Jeff
Rating:
Shooting Remington's New R51 9x19mm Plus P Semi-Automatic Pistol - Gunblast.com 4.8 out of 5

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Shooting Remington's New R51 9x19mm Plus P Semi-Automatic Pistol - Gunblast.com